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[Music] foreign

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hey there welcome to Denmark I I love Denmark\h
I've been to Denmark twice uh I I went in uh\h\h

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2014 and 2019 right before the pandemic\h
hit uh started in Sweden I have to say\h\h

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um okay I bought a Volvo car and drove it\h
into Denmark but I had a lovely country and\h\h

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I've enjoyed my time there so very much each\h
time I'm glad to hear that I'm glad to hear\h\h

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that and uh I must admit I'm a pretty big fan I I\h
of course I know Dark Skies very well and all the\h\h

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projects you've been doing I must see that's\h
the kind of career I I would hope for myself\h\h

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um to to do so much different stuff as you're\h
doing from journalism to TV shows producing\h\h

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writing it's it's uh it's very cool well it's it\h
it it is cool I I can't say that I don't enjoy it\h\h

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and haven't enjoyed it but I have to say also\h
there's a whole lot of stuff behind the scenes\h\h

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with any career particularly in Showbiz where\h
there's a lot of Heartache too I mean there's just\h\h

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it's a difficult business uh it always has been\h
it's going to be that way in the future but I've\h\h

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been lucky on a certain amount of things and and I\h
think if my luck holds it's looking more and more\h\h

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like I'll be in Europe this summer uh shooting uh\h
our film the last battle which is about the last\h\h

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uh battle of World War II in Europe so it could\h
be fun and maybe we'll be able to see each other\h\h

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other than would be amazing sounds amazing and if\h
you come to Denmark let me know but Bryce maybe\h\h

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for the listeners who don't know you that well\h
could you give a brief introduction of who you are\h\h

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and what you've been doing of course regarding the\h
the UFO topic both in fiction and non-fiction well\h\h

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I think a lot of people know me now because I'm\h
the co-host with Ross coldheart who is probably\h\h

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the best investigative journalist working the\h
UFO Topic in the world today and he and I have\h\h

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a podcast called need to know which people can\h
sort of get the background on by just going to\h\h

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need to know dot today pretty simple One-Stop shop\h
on my background it's a fantastic fantastic show\h\h

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oh thank you that's that's terrific I mean we're\h
hoping to make it even better we keep working on\h\h

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it but I started as a television news person um I\h
came to Los Angeles as the first CNN correspondent\h\h

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actually uh worked as an investigative reporter\h
myself at PBS for a while won a few Awards myself\h\h

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um and then the show I was working nine got\h
canceled and my wife said uh you know maybe\h\h

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you should try writing a screenplay because\h
the alternative was to grab my suitcase and go\h\h

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someplace else to be an Anchorman and so I tried\h
writing a screenplay and it was purchased uh made\h\h

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into a TV series up in Canada where they made over\h
100 episodes and and I really said to myself at\h\h

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that point if they keep paying me I'll just keep\h
doing it it's kind it's kind of fun and then I was\h\h

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attracted to the UFO issue um and we can talk more\h
about that but I I managed to write a film called\h\h

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official denial which was the first uh original\h
film that the Sci-Fi channel had ever done and\h\h

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um I put UFOs into a few shows like uh Lois and\h
Clark The New Adventures of Superman and then I\h\h

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created the dark sky series for NBC which is what\h
most people know me for creatively outside of the\h\h

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journalism aspect and then uh worked on Steven\h
Spielberg's taken series and right now I have a\h\h

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whole slate I'm kind of all in on UFOs uh um and\h
and I don't know if that's a good thing or a bad\h\h

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thing but that's where I am right now well I'm\h
right right there with you um and Bryce let me\h\h

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just ask you the the interest interest in in UFOs\h
or uaps uh whatever we call them these days did\h\h

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that start in in journalism or did that start in\h
fiction well it it started in in fiction but then\h\h

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I used the journalism skills that I'd gained\h
to look into it I mean here's what happened\h\h

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um I was I I I was I had a fairly successful\h
career and I already created a two television\h\h

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series and then I sold this uh this script to\h
um the Sci-Fi channel uh official denial and I\h\h

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wanted it to be good so uh without believing or\h
not believing in UFOs I thought well I need to\h\h

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get this right so I started doing extensive right\h
uh reading and research and I kind of had one of\h\h

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those come to Jesus moments I don't know if that\h
translates into you know but in English it simply\h\h

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means you're just having the one of those moments\h
where you realize oh my gosh it's an epiphany I\h\h

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was sitting literally in this office it was like\h
three in the morning my wife is asleep and my kids\h\h

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are asleep and I'm I'm reading a book preparing\h
you know to do another pass on this screenplay and\h\h

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it just hit me like a ton of bricks I just thought\h
this stuff is real this isn't just a great idea\h\h

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for a television movie or a television series but\h
there's an authenticity to it which is kind of a\h\h

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chattering thing and I'm sure most of the people\h
who are watching are listening to us right now\h\h

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have probably had their own Epiphany where they\h
they realized that there's a reality to it now\h\h

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do I know what the reality is not exactly um and I\h
doubt very few people on this planet do if any but\h\h

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um but I knew enough to know that it wasn't\h
weather balloons and entirely and and so yeah\h\h

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that's what got me into it and then once\h
I was into it I started reading and like\h\h

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probably again most of your listeners um I had a\h
a wall of UFO books and uh I never stopped I just\h\h

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if the internet if anything has sort of opened\h
me up to exposing myself to all kinds of other\h\h

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ideas and certainly the success I had with dark\h
skies introduced me to many many people in this\h\h

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uh in this area and I've had deep conversations\h
with a lot of people about aliens over the years\h\h

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and they've been Fascinating People from Steven\h
Spielberg to Stan Lee uh you know in between so\h\h

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it's been fascinating I've enjoyed the time in\h
Hollywood I've enjoyed the chance to take the\h\h

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UFO topic out to people and and talk about\h
it like yourself and and your own listeners\h\h

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and and when when you watch Dark Skies it's you\h
you instantly know when you've been researching\h\h

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this topic as I have and our listeners have that\h
this is written by made by someone who really\h\h

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knows his stuff how much research went into to\h
making this and it's almost like it's almost a\h\h

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documentary level it's in certain aspects um yeah\h
who did you talk to and and and how did that show\h\h

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because you were the showrunner right so you're\h
sure yeah you're the All-Seeing Eye well Frederick\h\h

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I have to say there's not a simple answer to that\h
one we could probably do a couple hours on uh if\h\h

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not more on what went into making Dark Skies the\h
short version I'll give you uh the first thing\h\h

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I have to tell people is I created a television\h
series for the NBC broadcast network in the late\h\h

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90s called Dark Skies they we made 20 hours of\h
programming it's available uh the only place you\h\h

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can really watch it now is to get the DVD set\h
uh there's a European version and there's a an\h\h

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American version but in 2013 somebody else made\h
a show a movie called Dark Skies that was about\h\h

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alien abductions I wasn't happy that they sort\h
of took the title and ran with it like that and\h\h

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in fact Harvey Weinstein was the producer of it\h
so go figure um so I went when we talk about Dark\h\h

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Skies we're talking about Dark Skies classic which\h
is the uh television series that I created so uh\h\h

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it came into being in a in a way that we might\h
revisit in in a moment but for right now uh to\h\h

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answer your question about the research in it uh\h
my partner Brent Friedman and I uh literally built\h\h

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a time well first we came up with the concept\h
we said let's take the two great conspiracies\h\h

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um UFOs and in America John Kennedy and let's\h
put him in an atom collider and see what they\h\h

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come up with see what they what works when we put\h
them together so we did that uh for the pilot but\h\h

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for the series what we did is we literally took\h
all UFO events and put it into a timeline where\h\h

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one column was UFO events then we took historical\h
events not just in the United States but around\h\h

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the world even in Denmark and that was the second\h
column and then a third column we tried to track\h\h

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how they might relate to each other and what\h
was fascinating is that we did bring a lot out\h\h

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of knowledge about ufology I mean I knew the cases\h
the show took place in the 1960s so what we ended\h\h

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up doing of course is focusing on the news events\h
of the 60s and the UFO events of the 60s and and\h\h

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Incredibly many things did align so for example\h
um you know we we did a story uh that took place\h\h

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during the New York power blackout of 1965 and in\h
fact there were UFO sightings at Power stations\h\h

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uh right before it so it wasn't that hard to\h
find some of these things mixing but I think\h\h

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what you're referring to Frederick more than\h
anything is that what Brent and I tried to do\h\h

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is create a world a universe if you will for Dark\h
Skies where everything that you thought you knew\h\h

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that you you read history you read magazines you\h
read newspapers it was there pretty much as you\h\h

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thought you knew it and what we created was the\h
Subterranean layer where the youth UFO hello world\h\h

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just stretched out underneath that so so perfectly\h
and and I the reason we did that is that our take\h\h

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was okay if Roswell was a true event which I\h
to this day believe was a true anomalous event\h\h

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then that would mean in our movie where it starts\h
in in our TV series where it starts in 1960 that\h\h

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the the powers that be it had uh over a decade\h
and a half to try to figure out what to do about\h\h

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it and so our series takes place in uh in a group\h
called Majestic 12. again borrowing from UFO uh\h\h

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Legacy stuff so that's that's why that's why it\h
turned out the way it did and I think the reason\h\h

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it feels the way it feels is that um we we didn't\h
take it uh slightly we we cared about it uh there\h\h

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have been other shows that have different\h
philosophies uh Project Blue Book which you\h\h

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know many people liked did not care whether their\h
episodes were true in the least they sort of used\h\h

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the youthological thing as the jumping off point\h
so they were able they bent all the story lines\h\h

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ours again was the main storyline was what you\h
thought you remembered and the bottom storyline\h\h

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was this UFO thing so a kind of a different take\h
and I think that's why it stands out today to be\h\h

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honest with you I think that's why people respond\h
so well to it yeah and it's very interesting it's\h\h

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I would say watch that show if you want to be\h
educated properly instead of many other shows\h\h

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even documentaries that are more fake than than\h
Dark Skies um but in Hollywood in general Bryce\h\h

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um I guess that's where most people get\h
their knowledge of UFOs from right and\h\h

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that's why I think a lot of people also view this\h
as simply fiction right but but you I mean you\h\h

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don't so so how how did you sort of connect those\h
two also when people talk to you about the show do\h\h

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they get surprised at so much of this is actually\h
from from real research well let's face it uh I\h\h

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don't know if it's true that most people get what\h
they know about UFOs from fiction anymore maybe it\h\h

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was but let's face it UFOs have had a constant\h
amount of media attention from the beginning I\h\h

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mean in the summer of 1947 you couldn't open a\h
newspaper without reading something about UFOs\h\h

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and and it sort of continued with uh Peaks and\h
valleys throughout throughout the the decades to\h\h

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follow so many people have a passing acquaintance\h
with it um and then of course the reason here's\h\h

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what I explain Hollywood's uh relationship with\h
aliens as in about 90 percent of the cases it's\h\h

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the fact that Hollywood likes conflict I mean a\h
good movie has to have a conflict your character\h\h

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has to want something and somebody wants them not\h
to get it okay so if a character like ours in Dark\h\h

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Skies wants the truth then there are people that\h
don't want him to get it whether they be aliens\h\h

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or whatever but aliens provide conflict that's\h
why you get a lot of Alien Invasion movies and\h\h

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that's why you get independence day being a big\h
a big movie things like that so the audiences\h\h

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actually have been trained to like an alien\h
movie but not to take it seriously you know\h\h

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not to really say oh maybe they're real now that's\h
changing uh for the last five years since that New\h\h

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York Times reporting and and uh the release of\h
those three videos more people than ever have a\h\h

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passing acquaintance that hey maybe some of this\h
is real and that allows them to think about it\h\h

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differently but um I I think there's something\h
else going on here too even there are well let\h\h

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me back up more I used to say that when I would\h
go to a party or something people would treat me\h\h

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like the drunk uncle at the wedding okay don't\h
talk to Bryce about UFOs he'll talk your ear off\h\h

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and that guy okay and in the last five years\h
they don't treat me that way anymore now they\h\h

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treat me like a guy that knows something and\h
all the friends come up to me at a party and\h\h

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go hey Bryce come here what's the deal what do you\h
know about this UFO thing what's really going on\h\h

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people want to know what's really going on\h
however and I think this is something that\h\h

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you have found I'm sure and most UFO researchers\h
or interested parties have found it and that is\h\h

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even people who acknowledge that there is\h
something going on that is anomalous probably\h\h

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extraterrestrial or extra something non-human\h
let's call it non-human they don't want to talk\h\h

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about it they it makes them so uncomfortable so\h
for example I have uh three kids and a wife and\h\h

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all of whom believe I'm right about UFOs there's\h
not none of them would say well Dad's crazy or\h\h

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my husband's nuts or nobody would they go to your\h
face okay what yeah they don't want to talk about\h\h

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it if I bring it up um it lands for a a comment or\h
two and then it's off to something else and I as I\h\h

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said before and this is not a put down on my own\h
my own family but Ross and I Ross coltard and I\h\h

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have done 30 episodes of need to know and I don't\h
think a single member of my family has actually\h\h

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watched or listened to one of them it's just okay\h
it's just something that makes them uncomfortable\h\h

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so they'll watch uh you know if I have a movie\h
made they certainly all watch Dark Skies but\h\h

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do they want to talk about the reality not so\h
much even though they believe in it now is that\h\h

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changing a little bit but I think you probably in\h
your own life have seen that you talk to somebody\h\h

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and you know they'll they'll talk for two or\h
three or four or five minutes and then suddenly\h\h

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yeah well you know hey we took a great trip this\h
vacation you know and and change this up because\h\h

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yeah it's uncomfortable and it it really makes\h
you wonder about your own pla because if you\h\h

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make people think long and hard about this topic\h
and even just the topic of the universe you will\h\h

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see another side of people they will start to see\h
oh okay maybe all of this is kind of you know uh\h\h

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small time compared to the the big universe\h
and then they begin to make you know their own\h\h

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um ideas of what's happening and what could\h
possibly happen and that freaks people out\h\h

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sometimes I think a little bit the feeling of\h
being so small and um we tend to just forget\h\h

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about it right I agree with that uh but I at the\h
same time I think people are willing to believe\h\h

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that we're not alone in the universe I\h
mean you'd have to be you'd have to be\h\h

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unread an un you know not current to understand\h
how infinitely large the universe is and therefore\h\h

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if there's billions and billions of other star\h
systems that might support life with trillions\h\h

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of planets out there then yeah most people are\h
willing to say yeah we're probably not alone\h\h

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but historically the Carl Sagan's and the Neil\h
deGrasse Tysons have said well yeah the universe\h\h

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probably is teeming with intelligent life but they\h
can't possibly be here that's why they concentrate\h\h

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on seti the search for extraterrestrial\h
intelligence they want to say well whoever is\h\h

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you know joining us in the universe is out there\h
they can't be here and I think the unsettling part\h\h

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is this anomalous technology that has been in our\h
skies and our seas for nearly eight decades now\h\h

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is most definitely here right it's not we're not\h
communicating by radio signals with with whoever's\h\h

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there we're seeing them in our skies and we're\h
we're picking them up on our Radars we're seeing\h\h

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them under our oceans so something is here so the\h
the the thing that has happened over the last five\h\h

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years that is at least progress is we have moved\h
slightly from where people would say well I don't\h\h

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know if UFOs are real or not well I think that was\h
always a misnomer because UFO meant unidentified\h\h

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flying objects so of course UFOs have always\h
been here because there's always been things\h\h

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that are unidentified the question is do they\h
represent anomalous and or non-human technology\h\h

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and increasingly the government seems the U.S\h
government and other governments around the world\h\h

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seem to be more and more comfortable with saying\h
well yeah um they're real uh we don't make them\h\h

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uh we're pretty sure Russia doesn't make them and\h
we don't think China makes them so you know do the\h\h

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math somebody else go go figure them and that's\h
that's a little disturbing and that's what I think\h\h

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we are in right now the next decade is going to be\h
moving past the are they real to asking ourselves\h\h

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why are they here what do they represent all and\h
all the questions are we safe I mean what's their\h\h

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agenda so uh and and all of that so we're entering\h
you know it's not getting less interesting it's\h\h

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getting more interesting definitely definitely and\h
the reason why I said before you know that maybe\h\h

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some people get their knowledge from from movies\h
and that make them believe that this is fiction\h\h

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it's because you know I was born in the 80s um\h
my dad he was born in the 40s and you know he he\h\h

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believed that this was real and I found that out\h
after his death 10 years ago actually by looking\h\h

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in his old old um UFO magazines and he actually\h
had like a handwritten note about JFK and hoping\h\h

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for more really yeah it's kind of a story yeah so\h
when I grew up with him I just thought oh he likes\h\h

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science fiction and we we would watch you know\h
Close Encounters and all of those Classic Movies\h\h

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X-Files Dark Skies all of this and just I just\h
looked at it as pure fiction because right from my\h\h

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generation you know we grew up with ET and stuff\h
like this and we had no idea that some of these\h\h

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stories for instance Close Encounters actually\h
came from real research so we were just completely\h\h

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I was completely taken aback when I found out that\h
he actually had like a genuine belief in in in the\h\h

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subject and that kind of changed something in me\h
as well and we are living in a you know an era I\h\h

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think that reminds reminds me a lot of the 50s\h
and 60s where you know you could actually have\h\h

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conversation with people about this stuff and\h
there was like an authenticity to the to the to\h\h

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the subject that I felt went away in the 80s and\h
the 90s a little bit personally well I mean let's\h\h

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there's been a storied history of of uh sort of\h
commingling between official them and Hollywood\h\h

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um it hasn't you know Hollywood didn't discover\h
UFOs with Close Encounters of the Third Kind the\h\h

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very first uh UFO themed film was made in 1950\h
and it was called the Flying Saucer and in the\h\h

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50s they had a series of them Earth versus the\h
flying saucers The Day the Earth Stood Still War\h\h

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of the Worlds um you know the all all of those\h
classic 50s movies were Alien movies so people\h\h

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were talking about it they were going to movies\h
uh and and some of those movies um had connections\h\h

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uh one in particular and I'm I'm blanking on the\h
title but did have the uh the CIA giving advice\h\h

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on it and then several of the others had to get\h
approval of the US military uh for production\h\h

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help and and some got it and some didn't so\h
there's always been this kind of relationship\h\h

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um and but it is interesting I I take your\h
father's story uh I think a lot of us uh\h\h

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would be surprised at how our our parents uh\h
thought about it I like for example you said\h\h

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that your father and you used to be able to go\h
to these uh you know science fiction movies and\h\h

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enjoy those together so that would be kind of a\h
logical way to sort of dip your toe in the water\h\h

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now my father was old school you know he didn't\h
watch Sci-Fi you know he he watched uh he you\h\h

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know his prime time was literally when there were\h
three television networks in the U.S and you could\h\h

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watch ABC NBC or CBS that's what he watched\h
he didn't go to the movies and watch science\h\h

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fiction or anything but for example so he was a\h
pretty hardcourse he would have been skeptical\h\h

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um but I remember when I was doing Dark Skies he\h
had gone to one of his uh he was a World War II\h\h

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vet and he'd gone to a Troop Carrier reunion\h
and he he came to me and he said you know\h\h

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um I just saw one of my buddies from World War II\h
and he was transferred to Roswell right after we\h\h

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broke up and you know I got to go home he went\h
to Roswell and this person had taken him aside\h\h

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and said hey Harvey come here um your son's the\h
guy with that dark sky Series right my dad said\h\h

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yes and he said well you tell him he's right\h
on because I was at Roswell in 47 and it was\h\h

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nowhere nobody would shut the base down tight\h
like they did for this thing uh over a weather\h\h

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balloon I don't care how classified the weather\h
balloon was he said everybody was on edge he was\h\h

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being told constantly Eyes straight ahead private\h
you know that kind of thing so yeah I mean people\h\h

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have been talking about and you know what I think\h
is happening too and has been happening is if you\h\h

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think about it what caused America to turn against\h
the Vietnam War it's when our young boys across\h\h

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the United States in cities and in small towns or\h
whatever everybody knew somebody a family who had\h\h

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lost a son and it's happening with the Russians\h
right now in Ukraine everywhere across Russia\h\h

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there are parents who have lost children right and\h
so it's becoming very real well the same Dynamics\h\h

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been at work on the UFO slash UAP issue for all\h
these decades which is maybe you haven't seen one\h\h

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I certainly have not seen one okay I've not been\h
abducted I'm not an experiencer I've not seen a\h\h

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UF close and personal but um I know many many\h
people who have and that's what's happened now\h\h

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the people who used to shut up because they were\h
told hey if you talk about this you lose your job\h\h

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or you lose your pension or you'll you'll alienate\h
people they're not being told to shut up as much\h\h

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anymore and they're all coming out of the woodwork\h
and we're realizing that a Monumental um out of\h\h

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sightings have taken place and not sightings of oh\h
I saw so I saw this light in the sky do this we're\h\h

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talking about authentic sightings I mean in that\h
UFO library that I've got and it's mirrored by\h\h

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yourself and and I'm sure many of your listeners\h
it's it's unbelievable it's it's case after case\h\h

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after case after case it's never ending and these\h
are these are cases seen by military pilots and\h\h

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police officers and doctors and lawyers and and\h
and common people too and and and in every country\h\h

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on Earth it's like to deny that something is going\h
on it's just being silly right now so that's why\h\h

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it's appropriate that we're moving into this new\h
world view where we say well something's going on\h\h

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but I don't understand what it is and I'd like to\h
know more because frankly that probably explains\h\h

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how you feel and I feel sure yeah and um you\h
know doing this show and I know that you and\h\h

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Ross who's been a guest previously on the show as\h
well um you you know both know that when you start\h\h

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doing a show like this publicly a lot of people\h
contact you and lately I've been getting a lot of\h\h

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emails from people from the Danish Navy actually\h
which has been pretty eye-opening how many people\h\h

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have seen stuff dating back to the to the 70s\h
and up until you know late 2000s and you know\h\h

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I don't know why it's not because they are more\h
believable than than regular people or what what\h\h

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we should call them but it's something extra when\h
you're used to using your two eyes to locate stuff\h\h

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um that that is something else but but price\h
yeah sorry I was just going to ask you a question\h\h

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um yeah how would you characterize Denmark's\h
official relationship to the UFO issue whether\h\h

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it's the military or the government how does your\h
country respond to it that's a good question um\h\h

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we've been pretty neutral for a lot of years\h
I think back in the in the 50s and the 60s\h\h

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where my dad was actually active in the Danish UFO\h
Community we had a really strong Community I think\h\h

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uh then it sort of died out in in like I said\h
before in the 80s 90s you know there was a lot of\h\h

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it was more of a skeptical thinking uh of\h
this stuff and it it was back then when you\h\h

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had like more of a mono culture right and and\h
if the media if certain journalists are certain\h\h

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um people didn't believe this was real that\h
would be the story and that would be the end\h\h

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of the story actually but today you know with\h
Twitter and Facebook and podcasts and all of\h\h

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this it's changing rapidly so I would say I\h
mean I'm doing the show on on the national\h\h

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public radio right so something has happened\h
and and now I would say that Denmark is a is a\h\h

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is it a whole other place than they used to be\h
and people are being very open-minded taking it\h\h

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very seriously I mean we are kind of cynical uh\h
scientific people you know we we're proud of our\h\h

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you know educations and academics and uh we have\h
nilsport of course the the great scientists and\h\h

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stuff like that and I do this show actually not\h
normally with my co-host an astrophysicist Anya\h\h

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but just the fact that she's willing to do this\h
and I've had all of the a lot of the the most\h\h

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um esteemed Sciences on this show tells you a lot\h
that it's moving in in in in the right direction\h\h

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where we can actually discuss this no matter\h
what you believe the discussion is fascinating\h\h

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and if you're a skeptic or you're a Believer\h
you have this thing in common that you think\h\h

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this is an exciting topic so so no matter what\h
I just I I like to see everybody participate and\h\h

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that's where we are right now I think in Denmark\h
it's it's pretty strong right now it's it's it's\h\h

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interesting because uh clearly the United States\h
while it is a powerful country and certainly only\h\h

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post World War II it did exert a lot of influence\h
everywhere that influence isn't across the board\h\h

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anymore so the to act like the United States is\h
in charge of whether or when we disclose what we\h\h

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know uh seems not to be a logical way to look at\h
it there's all these countries including Denmark\h\h

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that could start immediately to start talking\h
about their cases in an official way and many\h\h

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countries in South America have done that you\h
know I think um I I just keep wondering who's\h\h

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exerting the influence over all these countries\h
in the world that more of them aren't stepping\h\h

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forward and saying we want to engage this issue\h
in an open way and uh I'm kind of hopeful that\h\h

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that's going to change the equation in the\h
years to come yeah because in addition to\h\h

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what I said earlier from the government there's\h
been complete silence I've had one politician on\h\h

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um and and he didn't I would say he didn't add\h
much sorry but um yeah we haven't had that kind\h\h

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of you know interest from from those places\h
at least but maybe maybe it's coming I don't\h\h

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know maybe maybe you know the thing is um you\h
there are certain countries in the world which I\h\h

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currently believe have have access to and probably\h
possession of Craft um that is anomalous and that\h\h

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would include the United States but some other\h
countries I don't know that it includes Denmark\h\h

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um but it could I mean there have been enough\h
of these these retrieval operations that you\h\h

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you can bet that somebody's got some stuff and\h
in fact that's the hot rumor isn't it I mean\h\h

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I'm sure you've heard it too the hot rumors\h
are out there is that as the United States\h\h

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begins to have its intelligence committees\h
look into this issue and is taking testimony\h\h

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sometimes from whistleblowers which is a brand\h
new thing that that there is this undercurrent\h\h

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of confirmation that we have in some cases perhaps\h
fully operational craft but it certainly wreckage\h\h

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and possibly bodies which is mind-blowing I mean\h
as a Young Man growing up I was content just to\h\h

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say well people are talking about UFOs you know\h
that's interesting looking up but the idea that\h\h

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there would be crashes I remember just dismissing\h
that as being Fringe stuff and I'm not sure it is\h\h

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no and I I still get that reaction in a way even\h
though I talked to to to to all the people who\h\h

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um who's in the know um because it's still so\h
far from what I considered reality a few years\h\h

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ago sure um so I'm still you know I'm still waking\h
from it from a dream uh in in a sense do you know\h\h

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what I'm what I'm saying I still I you know I\h
I flip-flop from from one side to the other all\h\h

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the time because there is this two sides of me\h
the past and the present that they're kind of\h\h

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struggling a little bit well you know and and I\h
think here's something else we all struggle with\h\h

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um you and I seem to share a a certain\h
commonality and that we believe that there\h\h

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is an anomalous uh element to this that that\h
can't be explained by our current technology\h\h

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and certainly the technology we see out there\h
wouldn't explain what we were saying in 1947\h\h

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unless that technology was timed unless\h
Chinese drones were time traveling back\h\h

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to 1947 and 48 then I don't know what explains\h
that so we are living in a time where we just\h\h

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we don't know exactly what to make of it and\h
yet we we instinctively feel like transparency\h\h

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and the word disclosure should be a part of it\h
well now I don't expect anybody to just tell\h\h

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us everything they know but I would expect\h
at some point somebody confirms that hey by\h\h

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the way let's shift the conversation but not\h
only are we admitting they're real but we're\h\h

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admitting they're non-human there's a non-human\h
intelligence that has been engaging with us which\h\h

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is where we need to be right now we need to be\h
talking about that why is that not happening why\h\h

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hasn't it happened well uh Dark Skies which\h
we started talking about really was kind of\h\h

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a tone poem about disclosure on the one side\h
you had the the head of Majestic 12 who said\h\h

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um the the pub the people can't handle the truth\h
all right they just can't handle it that's why\h\h

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we have to keep it secret then you have the loan\h
guard character was the young Majestic 12 agent\h\h

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who said the people have a right to know well you\h
know what it's not impossible for two things to\h\h

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be true at the same time it is possible to say\h
the people have a right to know and the people\h\h

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can't handle the truth and they can both be true\h
at the same time why would that be well since you\h\h

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and I have not been briefed into uh the any secret\h
society that proposes to tell us and share all the\h\h

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work it might be that the actual bottom line truth\h
is either disturbing or immensely confusing and\h\h

320
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maybe both so I I think we need disclosure but I'm\h
a little worried about it because um we don't know\h\h

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what would be disclosed at this point mm-hmm yeah\h
and and because you did the book 80 um after this\h\h

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disclosure right with the great uh Richard Dolan\h
yes and um you had the three phases of disclosure\h\h

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right um it's the yeah it's the the full radical\h
disclosure right right and the partial control\h\h

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00:33:58,620 --> 00:34:04,020
disclosure and the false deceptive disclosure\h
I don't know how fresh in your mind this book\h\h

325
00:34:04,020 --> 00:34:10,680
is and and it's funny you know Richard Dolan\h
and I wrote that book uh a decade ago and I've\h\h

326
00:34:11,520 --> 00:34:17,880
forgotten more about UFO since then than I knew at\h
the time but I I think what art what we tried to\h\h

327
00:34:17,880 --> 00:34:24,960
do was make it an intellectual exercise let's ask\h
ourselves there as as we said at the time there\h\h

328
00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:30,900
has been 5 000 books written about UFOs trying to\h
prove they're real so why should we write number\h\h

329
00:34:30,900 --> 00:34:37,020
5001 what if we write the first book that talks\h
about how the world's going to change once we\h\h

330
00:34:37,020 --> 00:34:42,180
acknowledge that and you know I thought other\h
people would come in on the heels of that and\h\h

331
00:34:42,180 --> 00:34:47,400
and render our book just the first of a a bunch\h
but here we are a decade later and it's still\h\h

332
00:34:47,400 --> 00:34:52,380
the only one of its kind that's been dedicated\h
to that analysis and I think what Richard and I\h\h

333
00:34:52,380 --> 00:34:59,280
were saying was okay I don't expect ever for the\h
president of the United States or the Secretary\h\h

334
00:34:59,280 --> 00:35:06,480
General of the U.N to walk out before cameras and\h
say okay you know by the way that UFO thing it's\h\h

335
00:35:06,480 --> 00:35:12,240
totally real it's non-human intelligence and for\h
all you reporters out there we have a you know 10\h\h

336
00:35:12,240 --> 00:35:18,840
gigabyte hard drive that you can take back to\h
your stations full of uh photos and videos and\h\h

337
00:35:18,840 --> 00:35:24,960
documents that's not going to happen that would be\h
full disclosure but I don't need it to happen you\h\h

338
00:35:24,960 --> 00:35:31,140
know I I understand there may be classification\h
issues and all that I'm not prepared to fight with\h\h

339
00:35:31,140 --> 00:35:38,100
um people about that but what partial disclosure\h
would be is what I've come to call these days not\h\h

340
00:35:38,100 --> 00:35:43,500
so much disclosure I would full disclosure is\h
that's disclosure it's like here's what's going\h\h

341
00:35:43,500 --> 00:35:50,100
on uh partial disclosure to me is more like\h
a word confirmation and I realize I'm parsing\h\h

342
00:35:50,100 --> 00:35:55,560
English words and it's your second language\h
so I don't mean to be you know putting too\h\h

343
00:35:55,560 --> 00:36:04,620
much value on that but confirmation is simply\h
acknowledging that it's real and it's not us\h\h

344
00:36:06,240 --> 00:36:12,660
if the governments of the world would simply\h
confirm that the public can take it from there\h\h

345
00:36:12,660 --> 00:36:18,720
then we would stop this constant trying to\h
prove this case is the case that's going to\h\h

346
00:36:18,720 --> 00:36:24,900
make everybody believe which frankly is just\h
one case out of 50 000 that have happened and\h\h

347
00:36:24,900 --> 00:36:31,080
instead we can move to okay that case is probably\h
a good case there's been other cases some of them\h\h

348
00:36:31,080 --> 00:36:37,560
may have been false but many of them were not\h
there's a reality to it that's where we need to\h\h

349
00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:45,960
get right now because we are stuck no even with\h
this five years of openness that we've tried to\h\h

350
00:36:45,960 --> 00:36:53,160
usher in we're still stuck we're still stuck where\h
nobody will just come right out and say it looks\h\h

351
00:36:53,160 --> 00:36:59,520
like it's a non-human intelligence I I think we\h
need to get to that and if I was a betting man\h\h

352
00:36:59,520 --> 00:37:05,100
uh which I'm not but if I was I well let me put it\h
this way I wouldn't bet my house on it but I might\h\h

353
00:37:05,100 --> 00:37:10,920
bet your house on it I would bet I would bet that\h
you know two or three years is going to make a\h\h

354
00:37:10,920 --> 00:37:16,860
big change and if we were to look three years out\h
from where we are now we will probably be in that\h\h

355
00:37:16,860 --> 00:37:22,320
period where the majority of people are willing\h
to admit that we're being visited by somebody\h\h

356
00:37:23,460 --> 00:37:31,620
I I hope you're right that would be extremely\h
exciting uh even though it sounds like uh we could\h\h

357
00:37:31,620 --> 00:37:36,480
worry about it as well but let's I think we need\h
to be positive because really if it's been here\h\h

358
00:37:36,480 --> 00:37:45,300
for so long it it hasn't you know harmed us yet at\h
least you know the problem I hear that too because\h\h

359
00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:52,320
people do say that they go well yeah you know if\h
uh if they met us harm we'd be gone by now well\h\h

360
00:37:52,320 --> 00:37:57,840
not necessarily we're thinking about a non-human\h
intelligence you know here in the United States we\h\h

361
00:37:57,840 --> 00:38:03,120
think in four-year terms because that's what the\h
presidency is right so we go you know we you can't\h\h

362
00:38:03,120 --> 00:38:09,840
even get a political platform approved you know\h
it's it's a four years and out kind of thing so\h\h

363
00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:16,140
but what if there's another intelligence that\h
thinks in terms of thousands of years instead\h\h

364
00:38:16,140 --> 00:38:22,320
of four years or a year or two weeks or whatever\h
but they think in 10 000 years all right well if\h\h

365
00:38:22,320 --> 00:38:27,780
they think in 10 000 years then the idea that they\h
haven't done anything outrageous in the last 80.

366
00:38:31,980 --> 00:38:39,240
um so you're completely right I mean as soon as\h
we we even talk about this topic as you know from\h\h

367
00:38:39,240 --> 00:38:45,000
our own rationale it all it already is muddied\h
you know because we we can't even think of it\h\h

368
00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:52,380
as as something that we we can grasp I would say\h
if it is here we we really have no idea why and\h\h

369
00:38:53,160 --> 00:39:00,600
what would happen well and and frankly um it may\h
be a very human thing to be thinking about well if\h\h

370
00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:04,980
they meant us harm they would have already done it\h
well what does harm look like you know to another\h\h

371
00:39:04,980 --> 00:39:13,920
intelligence um I I'd be just as afraid I am just\h
as afraid um that whatever this other intelligence\h\h

372
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:22,140
is is possibly indifferent to us which which\h
could be just as bad as as as anything else so\h\h

373
00:39:22,860 --> 00:39:28,440
um I'm turning off my phone there we go is it\h
Ross coldheart if it was cold hard I'd take it\h\h

374
00:39:28,440 --> 00:39:35,400
and put him on um you should although God knows\h
the biggest problem with doing uh a a podcast was\h\h

375
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:40,500
someone in Australia is Ross and I figuring out\h
with the calendars okay what would be a good time\h\h

376
00:39:40,500 --> 00:39:45,840
to have this you and I just had this issue here\h
right now it's a late morning for me but I think\h\h

377
00:39:45,840 --> 00:39:51,300
it's uh getting into the mid evening for you right\h
you're about oh yeah it's eight o'clock in the\h\h

378
00:39:51,300 --> 00:39:59,700
evening now right and Ross is 17 hours uh past me\h
so we have actually found that the best time for\h\h

379
00:39:59,700 --> 00:40:06,060
us to record is I'm at this desk at like two or\h
three in the afternoon my day and he's at his desk\h\h

380
00:40:06,060 --> 00:40:10,740
the next day but like at nine in the morning which\h
actually works out pretty good that's pretty good\h\h

381
00:40:10,740 --> 00:40:17,040
yeah very good that's pretty good okay but but\h
uh Before I Let You Go Bryce let me just ask you\h\h

382
00:40:17,040 --> 00:40:22,620
because you you all your projects really when\h
I when I sit and I look at at what you've been\h\h

383
00:40:22,620 --> 00:40:26,220
doing you've always been ahead of your time\h
actually I'm not trying I'm not trying to suck\h\h

384
00:40:26,220 --> 00:40:32,640
up to you but you know Dark Skies when it came\h
out in my book very much ahead of its time and 80\h\h

385
00:40:32,640 --> 00:40:37,680
disclosure and also a lot of your other projects\h
more maybe more unknown to at least Danish people\h\h

386
00:40:38,940 --> 00:40:47,460
um so if you were to do a UFO film uh show\h
tomorrow in this world um with all that we know\h\h

387
00:40:47,460 --> 00:40:51,900
now and now you're working with Russ coldheart\h
and you're right in the midst of it way more\h\h

388
00:40:51,900 --> 00:40:57,600
than you were back in the 90s how would that show\h
a movie look like oh well I am trying to do that\h\h

389
00:40:57,600 --> 00:41:05,640
um it's just hard to I hope so well but um here's\h
how I what I think the world could probably use\h\h

390
00:41:05,640 --> 00:41:10,800
right now and I'm trying to provide some of\h
that which is uh more projects that are not\h\h

391
00:41:11,460 --> 00:41:17,100
just an alien invasion project where the the\h
people who write it don't really know much about\h\h

392
00:41:17,100 --> 00:41:21,900
the topic and they're just making up stuff and\h
going this would be cool if this scene happened\h\h

393
00:41:21,900 --> 00:41:28,680
I'm trying to look into some projects that\h
actually are grounded in um well I don't know\h\h

394
00:41:28,680 --> 00:41:33,120
if you know the reality people will have to decide\h
but but the fact that they happen so for example\h\h

395
00:41:33,900 --> 00:41:41,100
um I have a project called captured which is a um\h
a limited series uh and it's based on the Betty\h\h

396
00:41:41,100 --> 00:41:45,840
and Barney Hill case uh which I'm I've been\h
fascinated by all my life and I hope to bring\h\h

397
00:41:45,840 --> 00:41:53,400
that one uh to the Forefront I also have us two\h
books about Roswell under option uh don Schmidt's\h\h

398
00:41:53,400 --> 00:42:00,060
uh witness to Roswell and Stanton Friedman's\h
top secret Magic and um I have a film script\h\h

399
00:42:00,060 --> 00:42:06,300
called the crash that we're trying to set up\h
which would be a a literally how the Roswell\h\h

400
00:42:06,300 --> 00:42:11,160
case was broken you know the competition between\h
Friedman and and Schmidt so that's interesting\h\h

401
00:42:11,160 --> 00:42:16,380
that's never been done before right because that\h
was actually the question I had the it's weird\h\h

402
00:42:16,380 --> 00:42:21,360
that the you know most famous case and one of\h
the most fascinating Mysteries Ever hasn't been\h\h

403
00:42:21,360 --> 00:42:27,420
really well probably I mean here's the here's\h
the problem uh it will Don Schmidt's first book\h\h

404
00:42:28,020 --> 00:42:36,720
I believe going back to 1994 was turned into a\h
movie for Showtime it was developed by HBO it\h\h

405
00:42:36,720 --> 00:42:42,660
came out on Showtime in 1994 called Roswell but\h
here's the problem you can't watch it right now\h\h

406
00:42:42,660 --> 00:42:48,300
it's not streaming anywhere it's not on DVD\h
anywhere it's missing so I've just set out to\h\h

407
00:42:48,300 --> 00:42:53,700
say look it doesn't even matter now's time for new\h
thinking and all that so I'm working on that and\h\h

408
00:42:53,700 --> 00:42:58,560
then I have two things that are very exciting\h
that really have me I mean it I probably have\h\h

409
00:42:58,560 --> 00:43:03,900
an abundance of things I'm working on and maybe I\h
should focus more but I can't help myself one of\h\h

410
00:43:03,900 --> 00:43:10,140
them is a scripted podcast which looks like we're\h
close to setting it up it's called undeniable and\h\h

411
00:43:10,140 --> 00:43:15,360
it is literally about a newscast you only see\h
it through the point of view of the newscast\h\h

412
00:43:16,380 --> 00:43:23,400
um after we have confirmation that we're not alone\h
and and what that looks like and that could be a\h\h

413
00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:30,000
podcast first and then a television series but the\h
script I've worked on that that I wrote Because I\h\h

414
00:43:30,000 --> 00:43:35,100
said somebody has to try to do this and and given\h
that I wrote Dark Skies maybe I can it's simply\h\h

415
00:43:35,100 --> 00:43:42,780
called UAP all right and it is literally uh an\h
hour drama uh could be on a broadcaster could be\h\h

416
00:43:42,780 --> 00:43:49,680
on a streamer but it's literally trying to\h
tell the story of where we are now in kind\h\h

417
00:43:49,680 --> 00:43:56,040
of a fictional way so in other words um shows\h
that you've probably heard of The West Wing or\h\h

418
00:43:56,040 --> 00:44:02,940
um uh yeah you know that kind of thing with aliens\h
right yeah so those are the things I work on I\h\h

419
00:44:02,940 --> 00:44:09,360
I split my time between trying to sell them and\h
trying to write them and um and in many regards my\h\h

420
00:44:09,360 --> 00:44:16,560
Hollywood career has been distracted by doing the\h
success of need to know that I've been doing with\h\h

421
00:44:16,560 --> 00:44:22,440
Ross because you know you can't go on the air with\h
Ross coldheart and phone it in you know you gotta\h\h

422
00:44:22,440 --> 00:44:28,980
be up he's sure he doesn't he sure doesn't phone\h
it and so yeah and so you know if I'm going to be\h\h

423
00:44:28,980 --> 00:44:36,480
if I'm going to be on the air with them I I feel\h
an obligation to to try to be my best self and so\h\h

424
00:44:36,480 --> 00:44:40,740
you know I just want to again tell people that\h
we've talked about it if you want to know more\h\h

425
00:44:40,740 --> 00:44:47,880
about that it's need to know dot today not.com but\h
dot today and uh that'll sort of hook you up with\h\h

426
00:44:47,880 --> 00:44:52,860
everything we've talked about and what Ross and\h
I've tried to do by the way is uh we try to give\h\h

427
00:44:52,860 --> 00:44:57,660
everybody a little bit of the update about what's\h
happened since the last time we were on which I\h\h

428
00:44:57,660 --> 00:45:03,240
think is useful but we also try to put this in\h
context because it's irritated the heck out of\h\h

429
00:45:03,240 --> 00:45:11,460
me to see reporters who don't know much about the\h
topic literally write articles as if the first\h\h

430
00:45:11,460 --> 00:45:18,060
time anybody ever saw a UFO was 2004 with the\h
Nimitz and that just bugs me so what I've tried\h\h

431
00:45:18,060 --> 00:45:23,220
to do is take the things that we're talking about\h
today and put them into a historical context so\h\h

432
00:45:23,220 --> 00:45:29,880
people realize this has been going on a long time\h
it's not brand new and I think that helps you to\h\h

433
00:45:29,880 --> 00:45:35,400
consider where we might be right now we're we're\h
not in the mid we're not at the beginning of the\h\h

434
00:45:35,400 --> 00:45:42,660
game we're probably at the end of the game yeah\h
and and do you you you were on that uh Spielberg\h\h

435
00:45:42,660 --> 00:45:48,840
show have you ever talked got gun to talk because\h
he he went out uh recently actually and talked a\h\h

436
00:45:48,840 --> 00:45:54,660
little bit about it uh General finally asked him\h
about it and he he was like smiling and rubbing\h\h

437
00:45:54,660 --> 00:45:59,160
his hands a little bit and oh it's very exciting\h
it was um yeah and you know a lot of some people\h\h

438
00:45:59,160 --> 00:46:04,080
when they've been dealing with the subject as long\h
as Spielberg you know going way back to the 70s\h\h

439
00:46:04,080 --> 00:46:10,080
they kind of get a little bit cynical about it but\h
he seemed like he was still you know heartwarm um

440
00:46:10,080 --> 00:46:19,260
yeah I've I've met Steven Spielberg multiple\h
times I worked uh well actually when I was\h\h

441
00:46:19,260 --> 00:46:23,580
doing Dark Skies I had kind of an encounter with\h
Spielberg which we don't have time to go into\h\h

442
00:46:23,580 --> 00:46:29,040
let's just say that Spielberg a close encounter\h
with Spielberg yeah had a close encounter with\h\h

443
00:46:29,040 --> 00:46:35,160
during Dark Skies then I ended up working uh on\h
his show taken that was on the Sci-Fi channel\h\h

444
00:46:36,120 --> 00:46:42,660
um and we did have multiple media meetings with\h
them at the time where we talked about UFOs and\h\h

445
00:46:42,660 --> 00:46:46,500
interestingly enough because a lot of people go\h
well he's been totally briefed by the government\h\h

446
00:46:46,500 --> 00:46:52,440
he knows everything and he's uh that's not the\h
impression I got um because I felt like he was\h\h

447
00:46:52,440 --> 00:46:58,680
like you and me you know he knows a lot but\h
he hasn't been told you know the bottom line\h\h

448
00:46:58,680 --> 00:47:03,540
so just like you and I are can go back and forth\h
and go well what about that case what about this\h\h

449
00:47:03,540 --> 00:47:10,860
that's what I felt from the man uh I felt he's\h
truly interested in it I note that you said he uh\h\h

450
00:47:10,860 --> 00:47:15,420
you know just talked about it and I had to smile\h
because one of the things he said in his interview\h\h

451
00:47:15,420 --> 00:47:22,380
is well you know what if they're us from the\h
future well my first movie official denial that's\h\h

452
00:47:22,380 --> 00:47:28,080
what it's about they're us from the future at the\h
end of the picture you realize that the people\h\h

453
00:47:28,080 --> 00:47:35,160
who are abducting this guy are future humans so I\h
had to smile at his smile uh which was interesting\h\h

454
00:47:35,160 --> 00:47:39,660
and then you know I I we haven't talked about it\h
but I used to be the chairman of the television\h\h

455
00:47:39,660 --> 00:47:45,840
Academy which is the group that gives out the Emmy\h
Award and when I was chairman uh his show Band of\h\h

456
00:47:45,840 --> 00:47:51,180
Brothers was nominated and I got to sit uh for\h
like a three and a half hour show with Spielberg\h\h

457
00:47:51,180 --> 00:47:57,000
and Tom Hanks so that was pretty fun so I met the\h
guy and uh you know I I think he's a brilliant\h\h

458
00:47:57,000 --> 00:48:03,120
director and I commend him for the work that he's\h
done to bring this forward and and I thought his\h\h

459
00:48:03,120 --> 00:48:07,860
interview could you know he could go a lot deeper\h
to be honest with you I'd like to get Steven\h\h

460
00:48:07,860 --> 00:48:15,240
Spielberg in a in a two-hour conversation and just\h
uh and that was the amazing public as opposed to\h\h

461
00:48:15,240 --> 00:48:20,280
private in other words you know when we were\h
working on taken we talked to him at length but\h\h

462
00:48:20,280 --> 00:48:26,640
of course that would never be released so I think\h
it's time for Stephen to go on the record yeah I I\h\h

463
00:48:26,640 --> 00:48:32,940
I I agree well uh Bryce it's been fascinating uh\h
talking to you and both the the Hollywood aspect\h\h

464
00:48:32,940 --> 00:48:38,400
and the real aspect which is why it's so it's so\h
fantastic right now that that those two are kind\h\h

465
00:48:38,400 --> 00:48:43,680
of melting in and you seem like the the perfect\h
Ambassador in these times we're having a lake in\h\h

466
00:48:43,680 --> 00:48:50,160
in a foot in each Camp so uh thank you yeah hats\h
off to you you said I mean you're you're kind of\h\h

467
00:48:50,160 --> 00:48:56,460
ahead of your time no pun intended um so you know\h
I'll tell you something I'm not the uh you're I'm\h\h

468
00:48:56,460 --> 00:49:03,300
I'm older than you and I gotta tell you um I just\h
have come to the place where I I lack patience\h\h

469
00:49:04,440 --> 00:49:11,220
um I I believe it's time to get to where we've got\h
to go with this thing and get this party started\h\h

470
00:49:11,880 --> 00:49:16,680
um it's time for the people that have known more\h
than you and I to share their work because I'm not\h\h

471
00:49:16,680 --> 00:49:22,080
getting any younger and I literally do not want to\h
shuffle off this Earth and not know I would like\h\h

472
00:49:22,080 --> 00:49:29,040
to know what we know so that I can feel whatever\h
emotions are appropriate for that so I hope that\h\h

473
00:49:29,040 --> 00:49:33,780
the show that you and I have done today and need\h
to know and all this all this other new attention\h\h

474
00:49:33,780 --> 00:49:40,920
I hope we get lucky and that the people who\h
actually do know more than us start to share their\h\h

475
00:49:40,920 --> 00:49:45,780
work because it's the right thing to do and I look\h
forward to that and maybe when that happens we'll\h\h

476
00:49:45,780 --> 00:49:51,060
have another conversation about what it all means\h
that would be amazing I would love that thank you\h\h